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Post Info TOPIC: No.3 (Bomber) Group RAF Bomber Command


Squadron Leader

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No.3 (Bomber) Group RAF Bomber Command
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HelloFirst off I would like to say what a bang-On site and a wonderful & fitting tribute to the memory of all those who served with RAF Bomber Command during the bitter bombing campaign of WW.II 

My interest is two-fold, No.218 (Gold Coast) Squadron, of which I am the association historian and the exploits and history of No.3 (Bomber) Group 1936-1945.  I am always keen to learn anything about the group, the men and women the aircraft and anything else.

 

In return I will be happy to try and answer any questions, you will see that I have collected a wealth of information over the years and Im more than willing to help ANYONE regards of Group. !!!!!

 

Kindest regards

 

Smudger



No.3 Group Documents.

Squadron Operational Records Books.
 
No.7 Squadron                 No.57 Squadron                No.138 Squadron
No.9 Squadron                 No.75(NZ) Squadron           No.161 Squadron
No.15 Squadron                No.90 Squadron                No.186 Squadron
No.37 Squadron                No.99 Squadron                No.195 Squadron
No.38 Squadron                No.101 Squadron             No.196 Squadron
No.40 Squadron                No.115 Squadron             No.199 Squadron
No.214 Squadron                No.419 Squadron             No.514 Squadron No.109 Squadron
No.215 Squadron                No.620 Squadron             No.192 Squadron
No.218 Squadron                No.622 Squadron             No.218 (Gold Coast)
No.311 (Czech) Squadron           No.623 Squadron
 
 
 
R.A.F Bomber Command Combat Reports (Air 50)
 
Air 50 Combat Reports from 1940-1945. Almost every Bomber Command Squadron.
 

No.3 Group HQ Monthly Summary

  
No.3 Group HQ Monthly Summaries 1939-1945
 

No.3 Group Monthly Operations

 
Break down of squadrons sorties.
 
 
Heavy Conversion Units and Lancaster Finishing Schools.
 
No.1651 CU                               No.3 L.F.S
No.1657 CU                     No.1678 Con Flight
No.1665 CU                               No.1653 CU
 
 

Station Records ( in bold complete)

 
RAF Downham Market            RAF Marham                RAF Oakington
RAF Tuddenham                     RAF Woolfox Lodge           RAF Chedburgh
RAF Mildenhall           RAF Wratting Common           RAF Lakenheath
RAF Witchford            RAF Methwold             RAF Stradishall

RAF West Wickham           RAF Little Snoring           RAF Ridgewell

RAF Feltwell                RAF Foulsham                RAF East Wretham

RAF Waterbeach                  RAF Newmarket                     RAF Mepal

 

RAF Bomber Command Night Raid Reports

 
RAF Bomber Command Night Raid Reports 1941-1945.
 

RAF Bomber Command Loss Cards

 
As above
 

A.M Form 87 Movement Cards

 
Avro Lancaster                Short Stirling           Vickers Wellington
A.W Whitley                     H.P.Halifax           Avro Manchester
H.P Hampden
 

A.M Form 1180 Accident Cards

 
Avro Lancaster                Short Stirling           Vickers Wellington
A.W Whitley                     H.P.Halifax           Avro Manchester
H.P Hampden
 

Escape & Evasion Reports

 
267 Reports to date
 

K Reports

 
53 Reports to date
 
Bomber Comand Daylight Raid Interception & Tactics (Air 14).
 
As above 1944-1945
 
Summary of RAF Bomber Command Aircraft Damaged on Day & Night Raids (Air 14)
 
As above 1944-1945
 
Day Bomb Raid Sheets (Air 14)
 
As above 1944-1945.
 
 
 
 
No.3 Group Form E Reports
 
August 1940 - December 1940
January 1941-June 1941
July 1941- December 1941
January 1942 - May 1942
 

No.3 Group HQ Raid Appendices (Air25) 

 
 
1939 - 1945
 
(On Going)
 
Details on operations, number of a/c, routes, time over target etc.
 

BASE Stations

 
No.31                     1943-1945
No.32                     1943-1945
No.33                     1943-1945
 
 

Operational Training Units

 
No.12 OTU
No.15 OTU
No.21 OTU


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No.218 (Gold Coast) Squadron Association Historian



Air Commodore

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That is great!At present i am sourcing photo's for Matt;s site for all the squadron galleries,both RCAF & RAF so your nice list above is really invaluable!You might find some that are of interest to you also,amongst them. All are sent by the families- who still love and respect the memories of these brave young men

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Linda R Ibrom


Wing Commander

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Smudger
Thanks for the offer.  Perhaps your knowledge of 3 Group can shed light on some things for me. I hired a researcher to get the RAF Chedburgh ORB for 214 Squadron information, but he could only find entries from June to July 1943 (I was looking for March 43 through July 43).  I have seen some photos of ORB entires referring to 214 in the RAF Stradishall ORB. Would you have any Station ORB files that deal with 214 Squadron or could you direct me to the best place to look for them?  
One thing he did turn up was a number of 3 Group Form Bs for a series of operations in the same time frame which are very interesting which I would be happy to email to you if you don't already have them.
Regards
Dave Wallace

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Air Commodore

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Hello Smudger:

My name is John Neal, and I am writing na story about a young Canadian Fighter pilot who was killed on January 28th of 1944 in the area of Coulombs, France, on the River Eure, after shooying down 5 Jerries.  The townsfolks have erected a memorial to this man which was dedicated on November 11, 2005.  His name was Robert Oswald Brown.

Also on the memorial was the names of seven crewmembers of a #115 Squadron Lancaster, serial LL946, KO-V, which went down on June 1st of '44.  Three of the crew were British, 3 were from New Zealand, and one from Australia.  They went down in the village of Lormaye which is across the river from Coulombs.

I want to work them into my story and I need all the information I can get.  I have a lot now but wondered if there  was anything new on this crash and crew.

John

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John A. Neal


Air Vice Marshall

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Welcome Smudger!

It looks like you have a very impressive list of information.

Matt

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Air Commodore

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Hi john-Have you got the names of the 3 Brits in the crew that you are looking into?

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Linda R Ibrom


Air Commodore

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Dear Linda:

The three members of the R.A.F. who died when the 115 Squadron Lancaster crashed in Lormaye, France on June 1, 1944, are as  follows:

Sgt. J. Graham  -  F/E
F/S P.J. Hamilton  -  A/B
Sgt. G.E. Crumpler  -  W/Op

John

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John A. Neal


Squadron Leader

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Hello again,

Sorry not been in contact, recently moved house and the place looks like a Cookie as exploded, bits and pieces everywhere. !!!

My study is sadly still in boxes, but hopefully I will be back to formal within the next week or so. So please bear with me, I will get around to answering any questions ASAP.

Kind regards

Smudger


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No.218 (Gold Coast) Squadron Association Historian



Squadron Leader

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Hi John,

Sorry about the delay in answering recently moved home and study is in a mess, however from details avialable.

Flight Sergeant Alistair McRea McLachlan NZ422299 RNZAF, age 23.

Joined No.115 (Bomber) Squadron April 1944 ( no posting in date in ORB )

Successfully carried out 6 operations,

1/2nd May 1944 Chambly, Lancaster LM510 'A'
10/11th May 1944 Courtrai, Lancaster HK551 'T'
19/20th May 1944 Le Mans, Lancaster HK550 'Y'
21/22nd May 1944 Duisburg, Lancaster HK552 'J'
22/23rd May 1944 Dortmund, Lancaster, HK542 'J' (sic)
27/28th May 1944 Aachen, Lancaster HK550 'Y'

31st May / 1st June 1944, Trappes, Lancaster LL936 'V' FTR

Bomb-load 6 x 1000lb + 6 x 500lb + 4 x 500lb.

No.3 Group dispatched :

1st Wave : 15 Lancaster of No.32 Base 26 Lancsters of No.33 Base. Over target H-Hour - H + 3

2nd Wave : 32 Lancasters of No.32 Base, 27 Lancasters of No.33 Base. Over target H-Hour + 2 - H + 5


Time Over Target : 0130hrs

No.115 (Bomber) Squadron.  22 a/c briefed, 3 failed to take-off, 4 returned early, 1 FTR.  Aircraft drawn from 'A' Flight, 8 a/c, 7 a/c 'B' Flight, 7 a/c 'C' Flight.  


Cheers


Steve

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No.218 (Gold Coast) Squadron Association Historian



Air Commodore

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Thank you Smudger for all that interesting information, but all I really needed to know was who their Parents were, and what towns they came from, and maybe the closest surviving relative.  The mechanics of the operation were of little interest.

There is a brand new Memorial in the village of Chandelles, on the River Eure, to commemorate all seven from the 115 flight as well as Robert Oswald Brown of the RCAF and Clarence J. Moore of the U.S.A.A.F.  All nine of these aviators were killed in the area.  All their names are inscribed on the memorial.

Besides writing the story, I want to help honour these Men by having the flags of their country waving over the 'Stele'.  The flags of Great Britain, New Zealand, and Australia are missing.  I am seeking a source for them to  send to the Mayor of the adjoining village, Coulombs, who is responsible fot promoting the memorial.

I have arranged for a friend of mine, Rev. Tom Wilson, to perform a memorial service for the aviators whenever he is able to visit the memorial.  He is on a Sabbatical in France for a year.  If possible, I would like the additional flags to be there when he arrives.

Once Tom arrives there, performs the ceremony, and sends me the pictures he says will be taken, the competed story of "The Boy from Daysland" will be ready for publication.

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John A. Neal


Air Vice Marshall

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John,


Here is the email address of a gent that has done a great deal of research on airmen from New Zealand, he may have the particulars on F/S Alistair McLachlan that you are seeking.

errol.martyn@xtra.co.nz


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Anonymous

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To Smudgersmith,

Hi, my name is John Pollard from Australia. My father, Joe Pollard flew 34 ops with 630 Squadron, from April 44 to Aug 44. Dad was a rear gunner in Lancs.

However, I have a photo of him and his crew standing behind their Stirling.

My father told me that he had flown in Stirlings, how many, I don't know. I am still trying to find that out. I am also trying to establish which HCU he was attached to.

I am lucky to have obtained his full operations listing from his Flight Engineer, Harry Parkins, who sent me this particular photo. I will need to ask Harry or his son Keith ( who has created the Harry Parkins / K for Kitty Crew site) for their permission.

What puzzles me is that my father mentioned the 'Nuremburg Raid'
(31 March 44) ( This was 2 to 3 weeks before he went to 630 Squadron )and how rough it was but Harry had no recollection of it and said that maybe dad had gotten it mixed up with another op. My father rarely spoke of his time but some with things, he seemed quite sure of. Maybe Harry was right, but I'm trying to establish / cancel out what I can.  

I believe 'Harris' sent some HCU on this raid and I'm thinking that maybe my father flew in a Stirling on this raid before the formation of their crew to 630 Squadron / Lancaster conversion.

I welcome any details you my find.

Many thanks,

John Pollard

  


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Air Vice Marshall

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Seems like a look through the 630 sqn ORBs will answer most of your questions.

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Wing Commander

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I had a look through Martin Middlebrook's book "The Nuremberg Raid" which has listings of all the units participating and I don't see any OTUs or HCUs mentioned. Also it appears that Stirlings were not part of the force sent to Nuremberg, although 20 Stirlings were sent mine laying off the French coast that night.
Regards
Dave Wallace

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Anonymous

Date:
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Hi John
CWGC gives McLachan's parents and http://muse.aucklandmuseum.com/databases/general/RecordDetail.aspx?datasetID=520&SearchID=552354&Ordinal=1&Dataset=Cenotaph&OriginalID=21003
This site gives a photo but the detail is a bit sparse
Regards
Dick



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Anonymous

Date:
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Sorry John the Aukland Museum Cenotaph gave the wrong photo I think this will be OK  http://muse.aucklandmuseum.com/databases/general/RecordDetail.aspx?datasetID=520&SearchID=552355&Ordinal=1&Dataset=Cenotaph&OriginalID=29542

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Group Captain

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Hi John,
In taking a look at the "Bomber Command War Diaries" for March 30/31/1944 Nuremberg, 795 aircraft were dispatched consisting of 572 Lancasters, 214 Halifaxes,and 9 Mosquitoes. 64 Lancasters and 31 Halifaxes were lost. There was a diversion operation but no Stirlings were involved. According to the Diaries the only Stirlings recorded for this night were 6 that were detailed for minelaying off Texel and Le Havre. It does, however, show that there was 8 O.T.U. sorties but does not say what type of aircraft were involved. Hope this helps. Bill.

-- Edited by William Heron at 20:49, 2007-10-05

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Bill Heron

James A Little

Date:
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At 0225hrs on 24th June 1943, my 7th birthday, Wellington X HZ412 DT-U, 192 Squadron, piloted by P/O Edward Victor Eastham was probably shot out of the sky, [whilst probably on an ELINT mission], some 30km W of Katwijk, Netherlands. Earlier in the year, I had seen the aircraft Tail  Gunner, F/Sgt Joseph Livesey,in uniform ,  in the walled garden on the estate near Castle Douglas where my father was the gardener, and Joseph's father was the chauffeur. The other five members of the crew are buried in 4 different cemeteries in the Netherlands, having perished in the crash. Joseph Livesey is commemorated on the Runnymede Memorial, UK.
    Years later, I saw the name Joseph Livesey on the war memorial in Rhonehouse village hall.  Nobody , so far as I can remember, had said anything about his death.
 I would welcome any information about 192 Squadron duties around the time of his death, and any further information about F/Sgt Livesey.



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AJ

Date:
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Hi I have just joined today and are waiting for an email to come through with details of my account .You have a very large amount of info on 3 group to say the least
I am interested in particular on 90 sqn from oct 43 to end june 44
I am a very keen medal collector and having DFC group to D B Thomas a NZ pilot who flew during this time I would love to get the records of squadron op for these dates
Cheers Tony

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Aircraftsman 1st Class

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Hi Smudger.

My Dad flew Lancs with 195 sqn from Wratting Common.
I got down there in May and took some photos but have little more information about his work there.
I know he flew against Peenemunde and was involved in Dutch food drops and POW repatiraition. He trained in Canada before his posting.
Sadly Altzheimers affecting him now so he only remembers the general stuff nothing specific.
Do you records contain any of his ops? Anything would be great.
His name was Derick Bryan Rowe, he uses his second name but I don't know what the RAF view on this sort of thing...

Can I offer in return the pictures I took in May of various huts etc?

jandnrowe



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Aircraftsman 1st Class

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Hi Smudgersmith

You have an impressive collection of really important records.

My uncle was a radio operator/airgunner with 514 squadron flying out of Waterbeach. His Lancaster was shot down on 11 December 1944 - sadly the entire crew was killed.  I would be most grateful indeed if you would let me know how I could obtain copies of the 514 Squadron Operational Records Books and the Station records for Waterbeach.

I look forward to hearing from you.

with all good wishes

Nigel


-- Edited by Tallyho_1 on Thursday 19th of November 2009 02:20:42 PM

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Nigel Atter
jake

Date:
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Hello Smudger,
Very interested in 90 Squadron when it was at Tuddenham,particularly 1945 can you help with ORB. also do you have anything on P/O SMITH all I know is that he flewwith 90 Sq from Tuddenham, I am looking for his aircraft details partcularly in February 1945
Many thanks

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kate

Date:
RE: No.3 (Bomber) Group RAF Bomber Command - F/Sgt J.C. James
Permalink   


Hello Smudger!
Please can you help me? Do you have any  information relating to 186 squadron, in particular the orb's
 - 31 base  from september 1944 ?

RAF Bomber Command Night Raid Reports
for Jan - 14th April 1944
or anything linked to RAF Woolfox Lodge or Stradishall - we have found letters he sent home from both these locations  

I have traced my late Uncles records as he was a navigator and based at these locations, he was sadly killed in a mid air collision at Stradishall on the 14/4/45, but I am  keen to establish which raids etc he may have been a part of. His name was F/Sgt J.C. James

many thanks Kate


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Flight Lieutenant

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RE: No.3 (Bomber) Group RAF Bomber Command
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Hello Kate,

I'm not sure what other info you have but your uncle was on an operation to Kiel on 13/14 April 1945, in Lancaster ND488, and on return to base, collided with another Lancaster of the same squadron.

Your uncle's aircraft crashed with the loss of all on board.
Four of the crew of the other Lancaster died in the crash, and the Air Bomber Sgt Bartlett died the next day.

Thats all I have at the moment.

Regards,
Wayne.

 



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Kate

Date:
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Wayne
thanks for this info would be very grateful if you have any other details
TTFN Kate

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Flight Sergeant

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Hi Smudger, I see that you mention 419 Sqdn. Would it be possible to obtain any  information you have on 419, especially crew member snaps and reports. My uncle, William Longmore and all his crew members were shot down over France 8th August 1944. All seven are buried in the local churchyard. I look forward to hearing from you.
Bill

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Talk to you soon, Bill
m_spalding@sky.com

Date:
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hello . i am currently researching my wifes uncle who served with 195 squadron raf 1943-1945 he died during a bombing run we think over berlin. he was 19 at the time and we beleive his bomber ( a lancaster) was shot down the crew bailed out and all but one was captured. we beleive 3 were hanged and the others were shot. the one that escaped died of neumonia. we are trying to peice together what his last few days were like for him and hopefully peice together the short life he had.his service no was 3025425, donald sheppard, died 8th march 1945

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Air Commodore

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Hi,

you probably have found the following info on the lost bombers site:-

Mike.

Lancaster NG186 Information

Type Lancaster
Serial Number NG186
Squadron 195
X1D A4-O
Operation Dessau
Date 1 7th March 1945
Date 2 8th March 1945

Further Information

"Serial range NF906 - NG503 This aircraft was one of 400 Lancasters ordered from Armstrong Whitworth aircraft (Baginton) and delivered from Jul44 to Feb45 mainly with Merlin 24 engines from Baginton and Bitteswell. NG186 was delivered to No.195 Sqdn 8Oct44. NG186 took part in the key Operations against Dresden 13/14Feb45 and Cologne 2Mar45-Daylight. No record of total hours. Formerly an Ground-Support Squadron equipped with Typhoons, No.195 Sqdn was re-formed as a bomber squadron from a nucleus of personnel drawn from No.115 Sqdn at Witchford 1Oct44. From amongst the rash of 'new' Lancaster Squadrons forming in the Autumn of 1944, No.195 Sqdn sustained the heaviest losses up to the turn of the year. Airborne 1706 7Mar45 from Wratting Common. Crashed near the small town of B_ttstadt, E of the main highway between K_lleda and Weimar. W/O Howe died from his wounds 15Mar45, while being treated at B_ttstadt Krankenhaus. With his six comrades, he is now buried in the Berlin 1939-45 War Cemetery. F/O Appleyard gained his DFM with No.106 Sqdn, details being Gazetted 27Jun44. Note. No.195 Sqdn had a run of excellent good fortune in 1945, and the above crew were the only airmen reported missing from Jan45 to May45. Tragically, six baled out safely and landed unhurt, only to be brutally put to death by the SS. W/O Howe, meanwhile, was found by a Herr Kurt Stiebritz and he cared for the wounded airman until 13Mar45, when an SS doctor from the Buchenwald Concentration Camp arrived and, having diagnosed pneumonia, gave the airman an injection and told Herr Stiebritz to take him to Hospital. This is believed to have been a genuine attempt to save W/O Howe's life. F/L P.Scott Murdered Sgt A.K.Robinson Murdered F/O R.Appleyard DFM Murdered F/O T.M.Draper RCAF Murdered W/O R.S.Howe Inj.Died 15Mar45 en-route to Buttst_dt Hospital Sgt D.H.Sheppard Murdered Sgt K.Woodburn Murdered "



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m_spalding@sky.com

Date:
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many thanks for your quick reply this is excellent if not sad information. a young man murdered and his freinds just before it all ended (the war).my wife says many thanks we have just found out his records maybe at raf records in lincoln and we will try and get hold of them. we will continue to gather and record what info we can for his familly.thanks yours gratefully

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Air Commodore

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I found the following on F/O Draper RCAF who was the Air Bomber.

Regards,
Mike.


http://www.vac-acc.gc.ca/content/collections/virtualmem/photoview.cfm?casualty=2079331&photo=52438




-- Edited by MikeH on Thursday 9th of September 2010 03:19:03 PM

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Air Commodore

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Hi

you may find the link below of help when applying for service records

Mike H.


http://www.veterans-uk.info/pdfs/service_records/raf_kinship.pdf


The forms needs to be completed and sent to:

RAF Disclosures Section
Room 221b
Trenchard Hall
RAF Cranwell
Sleaford
LINCS
NG34 8HB

01400 261201            
Ext 6711
Ext 8161/8159 (Officers)
Ext 8163/8168/8170 (Other ranks)     








-- Edited by MikeH on Friday 10th of September 2010 12:29:46 AM

-- Edited by MikeH on Friday 10th of September 2010 12:33:20 AM

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m_spalding@sky.com

Date:
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we have spent numerouse hours trawling the internet for info on my wifes uncle but as we are novices it has proved to be difficult, i accidently come across this web-site and it has been a great responce,we are very-very gratefull and the history of my wifes uncle so far has been a bit upsetting for some of us but we feel we must find out as much as we can about him and 195 squadron and so if anyone can help keep us suppled with info we are very gratefull any info will be appreciated

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Anonymous

Date:
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Hi Smudger

I'd be most grateful for the copy of 514 squadron's OPs book for June to Dec 1944.

BW Nigel




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Aircraftsman 1st Class

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 THANKS FOR THE INFO I HAVE PRINTED THE FORMS AND I WILL POST AS SOON AS I CAN

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Air Commodore

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Hi,

I dont know how much research you have done regarding who shot down the Lancaster.  According to Theo Boitens book " Nachtjagd War Diaries Vol 2  "  there are two possible claims that night, a 103 Sqn Lanc. JA857 or 195 Sqn Lanc. NG186


Oblt. Peter Spoden:      6./NJG6      Lancaster   50-60 km.  S.S.W  Dessau         22.29


Hptm. Ernst-Georg Drünkler:   1./NJG5     Lancaster         N.E   Erfurt            22.30



hope this helps,

MikeH

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Aircraftsman 1st Class

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since i asked about help on my research of 195 squadron 8 th march 1945 i have found a lot of info which explains what happened on that day it has been a really eye opening search i have discovered lots of things about who was murderd and how but as yet cannot find anything about what happened to my wifes uncle only rumours. i have some files but i dont know how to attach them to this message. if i can figure out how to attach i will show some of them

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Rob GRIFFITHS (Flt.Lt Ret'd)

Date:
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A former colleague and friend served with 218 Sqn on Lancasters 1944/45 by the name of Richard (Dick) Smudge Smith

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Leading Aircraftsman

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James

I realise that this post was from some time ago. However, you may be interested to read 'Confound and Destroy' by Martin Streetley. It is available on the net as a free PDF download. It focuses on and documents the activity of 192 squadron specifically including the ELINT operations and radar countermeasures etc. My father served in this squadron too as a bomb aimer in Halifaxes. Our fathers may well have known each other. My Dad bailed in March 45 and was taken prisoner by the SS and then hospitalised.

Jeremy

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Anonymous

Date:
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Hello Smug.
I have been looking into my uncles, missions with, 622sqd from 1/12/44 to 15/02/1945....then with 7sqd 23/02/45 21/03/45,  looking for as much info with regards,combat reports,photos.any snippets of information during these dates,
that might included the crew he was with was iam really strugling to get acrew photo,
We did hear that there captain I/OF Bacon RAAF 62186, brought back a burning Lanc on the 18/03/45, from a raid to Hanau, my uncle Sgt JA Cornwall,2210978,sgt McClemments,1592648,F/Sgt.Evans 1652888,F/o Huttlestone 154615.Sgt Taylor 1869191, were all killed on the 20/03/45.as i said Any combat reports any points of interest during these dates would be most appreciated,
Ac used Jan,,at 622----N P V B L T O Dec 23 --Q 
Les


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D Loyer

Date:
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Hello .  I can forward a few nice photos of the RCAF 419 Moose sqadron from 1945.  They includes group shots of planes and crews .  Also have a couple of navigator log books from my late father (78 sqd) and late father-in-law (419 th RCAF) of the 1944 to 1945 era..

If interested send my your email address  so the electronic copies can be forwarded.

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Mark Haselden ( Marko 74 )

Date:
102 Sqdn 1943
Permalink   


Hi there, this may be a long shot but just wondered if you had any info , pics, documents, etc on 102 squadron or 194 squadron...?, my late grandad joined the RAF in Jan 41 and was released in 46.
He served in 3 sigs school in 41
# 7 air gunner school in 42 and, 20 OTU
1652 BU Driggield
28 OTU in 43
108 and 109 OTU in 44
and was despatched to Karachi in 1945 with 194 sqdn.




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Flight Sergeant

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Posts: 15
Date:
RE: No.3 (Bomber) Group RAF Bomber Command
Permalink   


Hi Smudger, I'm most impressed by your collection of data; and having been lately involved in doing a bit of research myself I appreciate the time this must have taken. Well done Sir!

My reason for getting in touch is this;

A local laddie, Sgt. Charles Burton Hill, was wireless operator/air gunner when his plane, Lancaster HK594, was shot down on the raid on Stettin on August 29/30th 1944, crashing near Svenkop in Sweden.

Initially a Swedish anti aircraft ground crew were credited (by the Germans) with the 'kill' but it was later revealed that a nightfighter from 28 Stab1/NJG3 actually finished the plane off. This ties in with an interesting post elsewhere on the Internet (and confirmed by Lars in Sweden) site about 'neutral' gun crews aiming off deliberately.
Charlie bailed out over the Baltic Sea with Sgt JP Callan, Flt Sgt J Fitzgerald, Flt Sgt WD Watson, and Sgt DLD Moon.

Tail Gunner Sgt HW Causley was still in his turret, likely dead, while Flt Sgt DAS King kept the plane aloft long enough to let them out. He jumped when they were clear, and landed over Swedish territory, being home again by October from what we can see, though seriously injured.
All the others died, and only the bodies of Charlie and Donald Moon were recovered and buried with full military honours by the Swedes. 

Thed research began when a late friend showed me some photographs and letters his Uncle Charlie had sent home and which had been kept by his sister all these years.  There's a lot of stuff from his family being collated and copied and I think there'll be a real interest in the exhibition I hope to have displayed locally as it shows so much of Charlies life before and during WW2.

Any information on the Lancaster or the crew would be much appreciated, and though I have the Squadron ORB's for the month of August I'm stuck for crew photos, so that I can give fair mention to Charlie's mates.

I know its a lot of information to pass over, but anything on the places Charlie trained would also be of great assistance. I have some information from his service records, but his Log Book has not been found, and I'd be happy to see if the flight details of any of Charlie's crew are available.

What I have so far is thus;

Charlie signs up on 20/1/41 and moves to No 10 (S) RC Blackpool 21/1/41, which we've found is Squires Gate.
By 29/8/41 he's at "3 Sigs Sch" and the "REASON" column gives the letter "H".
29/11/41 seems to read "Stn Wick", Reason "HH", so we assume he's posted to the far flung North, to Wick.
There's an indistinct line, then;
"4W.O.U. India, RAF Base H2(?) Bombay" from 30/7/42 to 23/3/43.
Then what looks like "H.E" dated 27/3/43
Next we have lines as follows, with various dates;
"10 A.G.S."
"1 (O) AFU
"11 OTU"
"31 Base" dated 9/6/44
"Methwell (A)" possibly?
"31 Base" dated 16/6/44
"1657 @"
"31 Base" dated 23/7/44
"3LFS@"
"31 Base" dated 8/8/44
"75 Sqn" which is where we know Charlie was posted eventually.
 

Charlie had only done 6 'ops', and HK594 had done just 65hrs, so crew and Lanc were new. I wonder if any photographs survive of either?

Charlie's nephew Jim Bissett started all this and died just 10 weeks ago, very suddenly, and he would have been so proud to see "Charlie's Story" finished. In Jim's memory I hope to do so.

I've had enormous help from Kevin King, Wayne, Lars, Jim Smith, Lancaster1 and others, for which I'm most grateful, without their help I'd not have been this far on.



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D Logan

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If you have information on 419 squadron RCAF, I looking for more information all the time. Last month I started a website for 419 squadron during the war years. My father a member of 419 during that period had gathered a lot of photos and information from older sources, word of mouth and from contacts he kept after the war. So war it's a start but I want to add more for all the familes of the 419 who still look for that information.

www.419squadronbewarethemoose.com

 

thanks

Dan

 



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Irene

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Hi, we are researching my husbands uncles war records, 514 squadron, 3 bomber command. could you help us with any information



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AW


Air Commodore

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Irene,

Could you let me know his name please, and what period he was with 514sqdn, as i have the 514sqdn Record Book from July 44 to Aug 45

Alan



-- Edited by AW on Thursday 5th of January 2012 02:05:44 PM

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AlanW

Anonymous

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Hi Alan

His Name was Flt Sgt GD Savage, 1523833, 514 Squadron, he was rear gunner on LL678 (Lily Mars) and was lost on 12/13/6/44.   If you have any information or pictures of any of the crew of this flight and records, it would be grateful.  5 crew were lost and 3 survived.  I know helost his life before your records, but you may be able to help us.

 

Regards Irene



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Flight Lieutenant

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Hello Irene,

Here is an extract from the MRES investigation located on the file of the pilot P/O Delacour RAAF.

Plt/Off Williams states he saw his F/Eng bale out, and that the bomb aimer probably baled out. He was informed
by the underground that four crew were found dead in the aircraft and thought one of these would be the second pilot
who had ripped his parachute and therefore probably didn't get out.
Sgt Martin states the aircraft was attacked by a fighter on the way back from the target, and the port wing caught fire.
This spread rapidly and the aircraft crashed within a few minutes.

Pilot, 425136 Plt/Off H. S. Delacour RAAF
2nd Pilot, J16550 F/Off S. A. Phillips
Flight Engineer, 1625906 Sgt G. E. Martin
Navigator, 151087 F/Off R. G. Picton
Air Bomber, 1433141 Flt/Sgt G. Palamountain
Wireless Operator, 1580616 Sgt A. G. Benham
Mid Upper Gunner, J87116 Plt/Off S. F. Williams (R1917180 Sgt)
Rear Gunner, Flt/Sgt G. D. Savage

Regards,
Wayne.

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Corporal

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Hi Wayne

Thank you for that information, it was some information which we did not have. Do you have any more information regarding the 3 who survived?

 

Regards Irene



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Corporal

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Hi Wayne

The information which you have just sent us, you say that 4 people were found in the aircraft.  We believe that 5 were killed, which are Delacour,Phillips,Picton,Benham and Savage.  Do you know which 4 were in the aircraft and what happend to the 5th lad?

Regards Irene



__________________
AW


Air Commodore

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Irene,

         Martin, Palamountain and Williams, all evaded capture, references for the reports are.......

WO208 3324-2555 for Williams.

WO208 3326-2947 for Martin.

Nothing found for Palamountain yet.



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AlanW

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