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leslie · Squadron Leader

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Pigeonbird · Air Commodore

Dear Leslie:

I cannot help you with the crew, but if you are also interested in your Father's time as a P.O.W., I would suggest you contact Wilkie Wanless at wilkiewanless@shaw.ca. Wilkie is our resident expert on Prisoners of War and was one himself at Stalag Luft #3. He is the Pres. of our R.C.A.F. ex-POW Association.

I was unfortunate not to be among the P.O.W.'s, as I was only an Evader.

John Neal

leslie · Squadron Leader

Thanks for the info John, I'll give it a try. ONLY an evader? Give yourself credit sir. All who served are heroes in my mind!
Regards Leslie

Pigeonbird · Air Commodore

Thanks for the accolade Leslie; I was only kidding. My evasion was the biggest adventure of my life and left me with some wonderful friends. Actually, I was a POW for 3 days when the American Army, who liberated me, thought I was a German infiltrator. Three days later, I escaped again. Then 2 rousing weeks in Paris before flying back to England.

John

leslie · Squadron Leader

John, I noted in your biography that you had a career with the RCAF. Was that after the war? You are virtually the same age as my Dad who is alive and well and living in Kamloops BC. Did you ever know him?
Leslie

Linda · Air Commodore

Hi Leslie-
Can you tell me where the rest of the crew members came from e.g. Canada,U.K.
I have found a Barcroft Mathers on a Air Passengers Manifest for immigration.
Departing Honolulu for Vancouver 5/15/48 at 19.39
If it is the same man.
List of Air Crew Accompanying Airliner "Discovery"

1) Lohse- Louis Status Captain Australian
2)Schubert Leonard Co Pilot Australian
3) Probert Roland 1st Officer N.Zealand
4) MATHERS Barcroft Navigator Australian
5) Tierney Maurice Radio Op Australian
6) Worley Thomas Engineer Aust.
7) Sharpe Hiram Purser Aust.
8)Harrison florence Hostess Aust.
9) Deverall Patricia hostess Aus.
Dated June 15th 1948

He also appears on Jan 31st 1947 as navigator on a trip from Batavia Java to Los Angeles California with another crew,mainly Dutch for the Royal Netherlands Airways.They have him listed as English on this one.!
In fact there are quite a few lisitings for flights he took after the war for airlines.

Not much but interesting anyway!

leslie · Squadron Leader

Hi Linda
Thanks for your response.
I have no idea who Bart's crewmates would have been with Quantas. I know my Dad missed meeting up with Bart, post war, in Tokyo and in Vancouver. Dad was flying the Korean Airlift at the time. The information you have looks correct and it is probably the same person. The big thing is he still alive or does he have any relatives out there.
Thanks Leslie

dawallace · Wing Commander

Hi Leslie
I did a check of the online phone directories in Australia, there is only 1 BM Mathers, located in New South Wales:

Mathers B M
32 Corben St Surry Hills 2010
(02) 9280 2935

Good Luck
Dave Wallace

leslie · Squadron Leader

Good Morning Dave
Nice to hear from you again. Thanks for the information. I'll send off a letter and see if BM Mathers is any relation. I'll let you know. My dad was here a week ago and was pretty excited with the information I've been able to dig up so far. I'll be seeing him for a few days later this week and hopefully get some more memories recorded. Do you know what happened to the Canadian Memories Project? It had a lot of written stories documented but now appears to be converted to video/recorded memories only.
Regards
Leslie

dawallace · Wing Commander

Hello again Leslie
It looks likes you have been working hard at things, how did you do with the ORBs? If you would like a copy of the Little Staughton ORB I can send it on DVD.
The memories project page I just checked seemed ok which was here: http://www.thememoryproject.com/digital-archive/wwII-index.cfm
the other similar paage which is mostly video is here: http://www.vac-acc.gc.ca/remembers/sub.cfm?source=collections/hrp
here is the Australian Honours & Awards page for Mathers if you haven't seen it: http://www.awm.gov.au/honours/honours/person.asp?p=44634
Regards
Dave

leslie · Squadron Leader

Hi Dave
I'm getting there. I wrote the British Archives quoting the references you gave me. They got back to me and quoted about 135 pounds for the material. I haven't ordered it as yet as I am trying to get as much info as possible before laying out that amount of money. Would love a copy of the DVD and will gladly reimburse you. My mailing address is 3055 Lakeview Cove Road, Kelowna, B.C. V1Z 3P6.
Thanks also for the additional website info. I had originally submitted a typed copy of my Dad's last mission to the memory project and was dismayed when I could no longer find it. I guess I'll have to submit the recordings when I'm done if his wartime history is to be preserved.
I must tell you that you have been my best source of information and help in this and I am very grateful for everything you've done.
Regards
Leslie

Linda · Air Commodore

Leslie-Sorry the crew i meant was the ones including Kenneth Archibald, on your first post Were they all K.I.A. at the same time as the Commonwealth War graves lists some ,but different dates of death.

leslie · Squadron Leader

Hi Linda
Details of my dad's crew are as follows:

Sgt. Kenneth Archibald, Air Gunner, Service #1572931 From Garmouth Morayshire, Parents Kenneth/Mary Archibald KIA 13/08/44

Sgt. John Thomas Broad, Wireless Operator, Service #2042532, from Perranwell, Cornwall, Parents George & Katie Broad, KIA 13/08/44

Sgt. Walter Robert Charles Parfitt, Mid Upper Gunner, Service #922824 from Seend, Wiltshire, Parents Alfred Walter & Melinda Parfitt, KIA 13/08/44

F/Sgt. Bernard Arthur Pullin, DFC, Bomb Aimer, Service #175556 from Magor Monmouthshire, Parents, Arthur & Winefride Pullin KIA 13/08/44

Sgt. John Rawcliffe, Engineer, Service # U/K Mother Ellen Rawcliffe of 263 Ribbleton Lane, Preston, Lancashire, Taken POW #1589261 sometime around 13/08/44

S/L Barcroft Melrose Mathers,DFC, Navigator Service #A44634 Australian
POW sometime around 13/08/44

They were shot down over Luxembourg night early morning of Aug12/13,1944 while on the Russelsheim mission from 582 Squadron. I believe their aircraft #was ND969.

I have the info from the commonwealth gravesites and I have posted search requests on the various town forums for the aircrew. Did receive one response showing Bernard Pullen's name on the local cenotaph.

My Dad commenced operational flying with 101 Sqn. Oct. 1943, 156 Sqn. Jan. 1944 and 582 Sqn. April 1944. I also have all the missions etc. from Robin Riley at 156.

Thanks for your help and interest.

Regards

Leslie

Linda · Air Commodore

Thanks Leslie- I will try and come up with some relations if poss.!

Pigeonbird · Air Commodore

No Leslie, my career was wartime. I flew with #419 "Moose" Squadron at Middleton-St-George. Joined them on Jan. 11th of 1944 and was shot down over France on Apr. 22nd of 1944. Returned to England on Sept. 16th of 1944. My career was published in the book "The Lucky Pigeon" and I have all the remaining copies at home (Calgary). Look at the website www.bombercrew.com/neal.htm.

John

dawallace · Wing Commander

Hi Leslie
The RAF Little Staughton ORB should go out in tomorrow's mail and you should have it in a few days. The references I gave you for the National Archives had a fairly large date range but they do things in completed reels so it depends on where the dates fall and you are dealing with 3 squadrons. Mine ran about 80 pounds for 3 reels. I will gladly split the cost with you on the 582 Squardon ORB if you like.
I am glad to hear you are making progress and I am looking forward to learning more about your father's story. let me know if there is anything I can do.

John - The link for your book doesn't seem to work - how do I get a copy of your book?

Regards
Dave Wallace

Pigeonbird · Air Commodore

Hello Dave:

That's odd; the link is www.bombercrew.com/neal.htm, and whenever I hit that, the page comes up.

Other than that, you can send a cheque for $25.00 John Neal, at #3, 2024 Palermo Way S.W., Calgary, AB, T2V 3P1. That is for "Bless You, Brother Irvin", the story of the Caterpillar Club. For $5.00 more, I'll include a copy of my personal RCAF career under the title of "The Lucky Pigeon". I'll pay the postage.

The money is being used to help raise the Halifax LW170 and bringing it to Alberta (see www.57rescuecanada.com).

Thank you Dave

John

PHILLIP GIBBS · Aircraftsman 1st Class

We have just been looking at the forum and saw that you were looking for info on Bart Mathers. He was my stepfather and he died from a heart attack in 1982 in Dee Why NSW. He married my mother, Marcelle Gibbs and lived in the northern beaches area. We have been looking for some of his history. We have his badge with one wing, knew he was a member of the red eyed catapiller and green eyed catapiller club, a handmade menu of the Christmas Dinner for Stalag Luft 3.

leslie · Squadron Leader

Hello Phillip

So nice to hear from you. Your step father was my dad's navigator. i have written and published Dad's memoirs from the war and during the writing I was looking for members of his crew who survived the crash or members of their families.

It now appears Dad is the only crewmember left. Last year I was contacted by the daughter of their flight engineer and was able to meet up with her when I attended the 101 Squadron reunion in Lincolnshire last September. I do believe I have a copy of a letter written to her father from your grandfather as well. I also have a page from your dad's log book which was sent to me from another contact I made during my research.

To get you started I would direct you to the 156 Squadron website. You will see a link to the 101 Squadron website there as well. I am part of the team doing data input for 101 which is a long way from being finished but the mission details for your Dad have been input there.

Go to search crew data base for both sites. Type in Mathers and it will bring up his details.

At the bottom you can click on the various tabs and find more detail as to missions flown who the crews were for each one etc. Also on the 156 site if you scroll down the home page you will see my father's name Trotter. If you click on that you will find a bit of information about one of their operations, the one for which Dad was awarded his DFM.

Please PM me at zwinglileslie@gmail.com . If you send me your address I could send you copies of photos of the crew etc.

I look forward to hearing from you.

Kindest regards

Leslie

PHILLIP GIBBS · Aircraftsman 1st Class

thank you Leslie for your reply. It will be interesting to be able to find out more as Bart did not relate much in the way of facts etc, much like most of the guys who went through the war. Phillip Gibbs.

leslie · Squadron Leader

Hi Phillip

Thanks for responding. I have a lot of of other information about your step father as well.

He was captured like Dad after bailing out of the aircraft. They met up again when they were thrown into the same cell at a Gestapo unit in Trier. Dad credits Bart with saving his life during a tense moment while they were being interrogated. He also remembers Bart squeezing his shoulder just before he bailed out of the aircraft. Dad of course was the last to go and almost didn't make it. The paratroopers he ran training flights for in later years think he was onlyabout 500 feet from the ground when he bailed out. From there they were separated and although they were both sent to Stalag Luft III they did not meet up in the camp. Both were on the death march across Germany in the winter of 1945. From what I understand Bart escaped during the March and then was almost court martialled for doing so. That of course fell by the wayside as the war was over. He and Dad almost met up again on two occasions after the war. Once in Tokyo where they missed each other by a couple of hours. Dad was flying with the RCAF on Korean Air Lift operations and Bart was flying commercially. Then again in Vancouver, where they missed each other by a few hours again.

Leslie

PHILLIP GIBBS · Aircraftsman 1st Class

Dear Leslie, your prompt reply really keeps us interested. It is amazing to think there is a letter still around from my Stepgrandfather whom I met a few times. Any chance of emailing (ppgibbs@tpg.com.au) a copy, as well as a couple of the photos? It would help us to get to learn a little more about Bart and his exploits. We will understand if it is too difficult and please don't incur costs. We have just found out that we are able to get all this information which is opening up new horizons for us about our parents etc. Congratulations on the great work. Regards Phill Gibbs

AW · Air Commodore

Leslie/Phillip,

I have a copy of the 582sqdn ORB if you want anything such as scans of the pages relating to the ops flown.

Alan.

leslie · Squadron Leader

Hi Phillip

What I would like to do is send you a copy of Dad's story. This will give you much more insight into what the boys endured and tells about the operations, life in a prison camp and the death march. I will enclose copies of photos etc. with it. You can preview it at the website below under the tab About. The introduction was written by Sean Feast a well known British author who had written a bit about Dad in two of his books. The book was released in September 2009 and has sold over 800 copies around the world. Feedback has been awesome with most saying they couldn't put it down until they finished it. The cover won a best book cover and is a copy of an oil painting done for Dad which depicts their aircraft after it was shot up the night of December 2/3 1943 on their 4th mission. Just PM me at zwinglilleslie@gmail.com with your address.

http://www.againsttheodds.ca/

Thank you for your off Alan. I too have the orbs as I used them for a lot of my research.

Kind regards

Leslie

PHILLIP GIBBS · Aircraftsman 1st Class

Hi Leslie, tried emailing by clicking on your link in the above message but it was returned as the address not existing. Strange. Regards Phill

Date: May 20, 2020

hello

Date: May 20, 2020

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Mathers B M