New to this board and wondered if anyone had any background on the above aircraft....Was the plane ever recovered etc......
The background to this is that I have the Medals of one Sgt E J C Porter who was aircrew on this Halifax when it was shot down. I can see that he was in crew 60 at Croft, was 19 years old and was killed when the plane was shot down (nightfighter?) south of Berlin on 21 Jan 1944.I presume he was an airgunner but have no information to support that. Some of the crew survived but I've never come across their story
I've just relied on Google to try and find out a bit of background, but would be interested if people could point me in the right direction....was the wreck recovered? where did it go down etc.....
Ultimately if it exists the medals should go to a 434 squadron museum which I will donate them to but there doesn't seem to be much reference to 434 or am I just looking in the wrong places!
I was out on January 21st of 1944, and the target was Magdeburg, and there were quite a few losses that night. I saw several going down, probably including the Doug Hawkes crew (Doug survived and he is a friend here in Calgary). We received over 100 holes in our plane but managed to limp back to England; the plane was a write-off.
Don't know why your Chap Porter was south of Berlin, but it was a lousy night for navigation with 10/10ths cloud. I got a shot of Polaris through the one open spot that occurred, and that got us to the target. Lot of the guys got lost. We were coned, hit by flak, and attacked by ME's, but we were lucky to have had a great pilot who got us out of it all. He was an Ass any other time, but could he ever fly! Even better; our Tail Gunner, Johnny Loyst, shot down a Ju88 that night.
Thank you for your accolade on our first trip. It was a good introduction to what was to come on future operations.
I have always wondered what became of the other crewmembers who were with me that night. I am listing them below in case anybody recognizes a name.
1. Eric Hamber, Pilot, Vancouver, B.C. Did a tour on Ferry Command, then came for one on Bomber Command. Deceased about 1970 or so. 2. Sid Philp, Navigator, Montreal, Que. Deceased 3 or 4 years ago. 3. John Neal, Bomb Aimer, Verdun, Quebec. Still alive, I think. 4. Jim Hope, Wireless Operator, Toronto, Ontario, Unknown 5. Johnny Loyst, Tail Gunner, Oshawa, Ontario, Unknown 6. Frank Minton, Mid-upper Gunner, Canada, unknown. 7. Alf Kemp, Engineer, Great Britain, unknown.
Eric was a replacement pilot when our original, Chester McClure, went missing on a Second Dickie trip. Chester was from Ottawa but now lives in Toronto.
When I was shot down, I was with a completely different crew as a Spare. They were: 1. Pilot, Chuck Thomas, U.S.A.A.F., Florida. 2. Navigator, Robert Lindsay, St. Thomas, ON, deceased 2 or 3 years ago. 3. Pat Murphy, Wireless Op., Canada, unknown. 4. Archie Greene, Mid upper Gunner, Woodstock, ON, unknown. 5. V. Knox, Tail Gunner, killed in attack. 6. J. Thompson, Engineer, Great Britain, unknown.
Hello Dave, I am in posession of two "Loss of A/C" reports from Wilson and Cox, probably a few more files also, ORB's for sure. John, very good detail, hats off to you. met you in Nanton this past summer, read one of your books, still have to read the other.
Thank you all for your responses......and John thank you for your reflections on the night of the 21st January and your experiences. It brings things into a sharp focus to hear first hand what actually happened on those nights, and it has lost nothing with the passage of time. Thank you for sharing this.
Alan, thank you...I will contact you through the web page.
A little more information that I have gleaned (from Lostbombers.com thank you):
WL-K appears to have left Croft on the 20th January 1944 not the 21st heading for Berlin which would answer the query John pointed out. The aircraft appeared to complete the bombing run, and was brought down possibly by a nightfighter at Muckendorf SW of Berlin. It was actually the early hours of 21 January when the aircraft came down, hence my confusion over the date....sorry.
I have an interesting letter written by Sgt Porter to his parents which he's addressed from Tholthorpe and then crossed it out and written Croft over it.
Thanks Dave, and your timing has explained it. The night before Magdeburg was a raid on Berlin, but we were not on it. I received my first shock on the morning of the 21st when there were a few empty seats at the luncheon table. The old timers used to tell us not to bother unpacking; we wouldn't be there that long. But I was lucky; I roomed with the Station Nav. Officer, so I never lost a roommate. But he was one of the only ones on the station with a car, and this was why I spent so many nights in the pub, when we weren't flying.
Hi Dave, According to the book "Pilgrimages of Grace" a history of Croft Aerodrome the aircraft in question LL179 WL-K piloted by F/S G.C. Mould is listed as missing Berlin 21 Jan. 44. However, when I looked in the Bomber Command War Diaries book, 6 Group of which this 434 Sqdn. aircraft was part were part of an attack on Magdeburg. There was a diversionary raid on Berlin that night but it involved Lancasters and Mosquito aircraft from 5 & 8 Groups. Perhaps the 434 Sqdn. aircraft was lost on the homeward track, not knowing which route they would have taken it's difficult to say. The crew were as follows, F/S G.C. Mould - Pilot, (KIA). W/O2 A.M. Wilson, - Nav. (POW). P/O W.C. Drum, - B/A, (POW). Sgt. R. Cox, - W/OP. (POW). P/O P.R.A. Dack, - MU/AG (KIA). Sgt. J.A. McKenna, - R/G (KIA) Sgt. E.J.C. Porter, Flight Engineer (KIA).
The remains of your Sgt. Porter 1608252 RAFVR apparently were not recovered as he is memorialized at the the Runnymede Memorial in England on Panel number 236.
Hope this is of some help. Bill Heron/Niagara/Canada
I now find that this information is repeated in some cases but may be helpful nonetheless. Bill.
Hi John, I am in touch frequently with Sid Philp's daughter in Quebec and I put together a collage of his R.C.A.F. training and operations for the family. I have read some of Sid's writings and would loved to have met him. He passed away in December of 2006. Bill Heron
Thanks for the note on Sid Philp's Daughter. I tried to contact her just after her Father died but have had no answer till now. I was wondering if she knows what the status is of the other members of the crew.
They are having a reunion of #419 "Moose" Squadron out here next year, and I am helping to find former members of the Squadron, both wartime and post war. It will likely take place at Cold Lake, and the Government is sending a plane to Calgary to fly us there. I have found about a dozen so far, one of who is in Texas. Date of the reunion as yet unknown.
Perhaps Sid's Daughter would consider attending. If I can still climb onto the plane, I will be there.
Hi again John, I'll contact Elizabeth and let her know about the planned reunion, at the same time I'll ask if she knows of any of the crew that have survived, perhaps her Dad kept in touch I'll let you how it plays out. Best Regards, Bill.
Thanks Bill, and I look forward to hearing about any of them who might still be with us.
I received my copy of the December Fly Past today (came in 4 days vis surface mail, so don't pay for air mail) and it is quite good on the Halifax. However, I don't remember that big glassy space that I occupied as the Bomb Aimer. Looks more like some Classy Guy's living room.
Besides, they did not say a word about the most important part of the plane - the Escape Hatch. Saved many a side of Bacon, including mine!
