infomation on DONALD DEAN 617 SQN ?

Date: May 24, 2010

infomation on DONALD DEAN 617 SQN ?

k4kittycrew · Squadron Leader

Hi Nial and welcome to the forum,

Because Donald Dean survived the war, its not very likely to find info in say, Chorleys BC Losses, etc with the exception that if he was involved in an accident / incident, ie: aircraft ditched into the sea; then he and his crew MAY be listed but we would need some approx: dates. ( I have nine volumes of which relate to over 2000 pages of loss aircraft / accidents ) so as mentioned, dates do help.

Next of kin family members can obtain ORB's ( operation / crew details ) from the National Archives ( also online ) but there is a fee involved. These identify the person time in service.

617 Squadron was of course the Dambusters squadron. I've often heard people mention that their family member flew with this squadron, only to find out that they indeed flew with another. Don't get me wrong, nothing wrong with that because617 Sqn is the most identifiable of all bomber squadrons. It comes to mind easily.
He may very well have and it would be interesting to find out.

When I first starting searching for details of my father, I thought he flew out of Biggin Hill. As you may know, Biggin Hill was a Spitfire squadron, ( ie : Battle of Britain. ) Funny thing was, no Lancasters flew from there, it was the only squadron I knew of.

Nial, the search for info is a very rewarding one, should you start digging.
Regards,
John

wayne · Flight Lieutenant

Hello Nail,

I have searched the name 'Dean' through the 617 squadron Operational Record Book 1943 to 1945 and came up with no match for his name.
It is possible, like John has said, that 617 squadron springs to mind as it is a well known squadron, but perhaps he flew on another squadron.

There is a 619 squadron, perhaps he flew with them.
The best thing to do is get his service records which will show where he served.

Lets us know if we can help with anything else.

Regards,
Wayne.

Date: May 28, 2010

hi thanks for the replys , i thought it was too good to be true, i proberly think my grandads got a little confused he is 91 and does get abit mixed up at times with names dates times etc
thanks
nial

k4kittycrew · Squadron Leader

"hi thanks for the replys , i thought it was too good to be true, i proberly think my grandads got a little confused he is 91 and does get abit mixed up at times with names dates times etc
thanks "
nial

Nial, as you say, your grandfather may get some details mixed up but be patient with him.

The more you talk with him about these things, the likely hood of details falling into place will become more apparent. I'm nearly 49 and I can tell you, when it come to dates and details, that I struggle all the time!

John

Linda · Air Commodore

nial wrote:

hi thanks for the replys , i thought it was too good to be true, i proberly think my grandads got a little confused he is 91 and does get abit mixed up at times with names dates times etc
thanks
nial

Hi Nial,
Actually-How about 61 Squadron?
A Lincolnshire based Squadron in WW2
(They would have gone drinking in Lincoln)
Whereabouts did Doreen come from?,have you tried Geneology sites at all?
You can leave a message on my whiteboard if it is any help

AW · Air Commodore

Nial/Linda,
Just checked the 61sqdn ORB, there is a "Dean" among the aircrew but he's K.H. Dean, which does not fit.
Alan

Linda · Air Commodore

AW wrote:

Nial/Linda,
Just checked the 61sqdn ORB, there is a "Dean" among the aircrew but he's K.H. Dean, which does not fit.
Alan

Thanks Alan-That disproves that idea then!
Thanks for looking!

Doug Dean · Aircraftsman 1st Class

Hi, The Donald Dean you are looking for is certainly my late uncle (d. 1996 or 97) , Group Captain Donald Dixie Dean, DSO, DFC & Bar, mentioned in despatches, US Silver Star & Territorial Decoration.

I dont think he was ever with 617, but you will find him in 77 squadron and then as Wing Commander at 35 (Pathfinders), then Group Captain (at age 26), interspersed with some training duties. In early 1945 Don Bennett placed him in command of the Pathfinder (35) base at Gravely and there is a Pathfinder Memorial & photo of Donald at the nearby church in Offord Cluny. I think he was also at Witton. He gets numerous mentions in books on the Pathfinders.

He completed 98 bomber operations in all and ended up in the sea in 1941 on what I think was only his second mission following an engine failure over the FreisianIslands and spent three days in a dingy before being rescued. He nearly did it again coming back from St Nazaire with two engines out, but managed to land at Exeter, although over-running the runway. He was involved in the food drops to Holland towards the end of the war.

After the war he worked in insurance, certainly in Kuwait and probably in Saudi as well.

He married Doreen in 1950, when in the space of three weeks David & Martin, his younger twin brothers also got married.

I believe Doreen still lives in Leicestershire.

-- Edited by Doug Dean on Tuesday 28th of September 2010 03:28:46 PM

-- Edited by Doug Dean on Tuesday 28th of September 2010 03:29:50 PM

Marcel Hogenhuis · Aircraftsman 1st Class

Dear Sir,

I was wondering whether you might help with the following research: I am preparing an article about the events of 20/21 december 1942 when RAF Bomber Command was raiding Duisburg.
The German nightfighters of Venlo airfield were scrambled to intercept the bombers, resulting in the loss of some bombers.

As I know not much about the exploits of 61 Squadron that night (just know from Group Orders that 61 and 106 Sqd. sent 11 Lancasters together, I do hope that you might give me some details about the Lancs that were sent by 61 Sqd. (serial, bomb load if mentioned, time/altitude over target).

Many thanks in advance for any help you might be able to offer, a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year !

Marcel Hogenhuis
marcelhogenhuis@gmail.com

AW · Air Commodore

Marcel,
61sqdn sent nine aircraft to Duisburg, only four of these reached the target, the rest all turned back early due to engine or oxygen failure. It seems they had a mixture of a 4000lb bomb and incendiaries each. Those who returned early, ditched their 4000lb bombs in the North Sea and brought back the incendiaries.

W4236, F/O Foster, returned early due to starboard inner engine problem.
W4357, F/Lt Burns, bombed from 14,500ft.
R5699, P/O Dierkes, bombed from 10,500ft.
W4270, P/O Gillett, returned due to oxygen failure.
R5168, P/O Lind, returned early due to intercom failure.
W4763, F/Sgt Baker, bombed from 14000ft.
W4769, Sgt Walters, returned due to oxygen failure.
W4279, Sgt Champion, returned early, starboard inner engine trouble.
W4137, Sgt Dashber, bombed from 13000ft.
Alan.

Date: Apr 4, 2011

RE: infomation on DONALD DEAN 617 SQN ?

hi, came across this forum whilst googling.

My father was relatively quiet about his war record. He died in May 97 aged 79. My mother does indeed still live in Leicestershire.

What I know about his war record is that he was made a group captain at the age of 26. Earned a DSO, DFC (bar on each) and silver star (but never accepted it - he did tell me why!). Also mentioned in dispaches in 1943. I do not know what the territorial decoration was.

I have heard of 77 squadron and 35 squadron. I know little about them but 77 squadron initially had Whitley bombers. When my father was posted to 35 squadron he was flying a Halifax bomber in the Pathfinder force. He was also posted for a time to No 4 squadron flying Lysander coastal patrols (what was the purpose of these flights?).

A notable event was being shot down into the North Sea and it took three days with German fighters overhead before the crew were rescued.

I have some Dutch friends who told me how operation Manna really helped the people. I have siince learnt that my father apparantly had a leading role in this operation.

I am the oldest son, I have two brothers and two sisters.

Michael

Dave_Richardson · Flight Sergeant

Hi Michael

Did you know that there is an interview with your father on the Leicestershire Digital Archive, recorded in 1985? Here's a link:

http://cdm15407.contentdm.oclc.org/cdm4/item_viewer.php?CISOROOT=/p15407coll1&CISOPTR=108&CISOBOX=1&REC=16

The Territorial medal is probably the Territorail Efficeincy Medal which was awarded for 12 years service in the Territorial Army, war service rduced the requirement to 6 years. I guess it's a bit unusal for it to be awarded to an RAF Officer. Had you thought of sending for your father's service record? That might shed so light on it.

Cheers

Dave

Date: Apr 4, 2011

Thanks Dave, I have just listened to the archive record.

Is there a way for Nial and Doug to be prompted that this extra info (and the recording) are available?

Michael

Dave_Richardson · Flight Sergeant

Hi Michael

I don't think there is. A lot of forums have a private message facility by which you could alert an individual to a post. But this forum doesn't seem to have this facility. If they haven't checked the 'Email me whenever there is a new post to this topic' box then it will be pot luck when they next visit the forum.

Dave

Doug Dean · Aircraftsman 1st Class

Michael, many many years since I've seen you! I saw your Mum & sister at (probably) Cynthia's funeral a few years ago. As Dave has suggested I get an e-mail whenever there is a posting, but don't think Nial has this as he never responded to my posting.
I live in Colchester now with wife Helen, Lindsay 22 & Tom 20.
I've e-mailed the link to Bob (Martins son) who lives in Ramsgate, as he is in to family trees & history etc so I 'm sure he will be interested and will let Dad & Martin listen to the interview as I'm sure they will both be interested. (Thanks for the link Dave)

Doug

Date: Apr 6, 2011

hi Doug
feel free to use my email.

We went to Cynthia's funeral but I have had very little contact with anyone since then.

We live surprisingly close to you, in Brentwood! I don't actually remember too much of the various family members - have you been researching the family history?

Michael

Busy Lizzie · Aircraftsman 1st Class

Hi Michael,

I was googling too! I was overjoyed to find this link.

I couldn't believe he mentioned my Dad in the radio interview.

I am Allan Ball's daughter, a great friend of Dixie's. My dad was 35 squadron Pathfinders. Your dad was best man at my parent's wedding in 1945.

They stayed great friends over the years until my Dad died in 1990. Dixie came to some of the 35 squadron reunions at Offord. When my father was in the RAF home in Rustington, he invited your Dad to stay and I have the newspaper article with a photo of them both if you would like details.

I have lots of information if you are interested. My father was on the Pathfinder Council and I think I have just about every Marker magazine since the war! I could go through for articles on your Dad if you like?

Thank you, you have made my day!

Juliet

Doug Dean · Aircraftsman 1st Class

http://forum.planetalk.net/viewtopic.php?p=15825&sid=7ff8f611c10b9e7f9ebbbb93b62e1e30

This link has got photos of the '35' memorial stained glass window at the Church at Offord Cluny. There are apparently individual photos of Donald & other senior officers surrounding the window, but I have never managed to get inside yet, although Dad who lives nearby in Buckden keeps threatening to borrow a key so I can.

The book 'We Act with One Accord' by Alan Cooper (ISBN1 900511 83 5) £20.95 gives a detailed history of 35 squadron, with many photos, including a couple of Donald, plus some group photos and is interesting reading.

I don't think I can e-mail you directly from here, but if you drop me a line at dean(at)langham11.fsnet.co.uk ('at' might stop the spammers!) I can contact you directly.

Martin & Sue have just celebrated their 60th anniversary & Dad recalled how the three brothers all went in to see grandad together as they were all scared of him.

Martin "I'm getting married on the 11th May"

David "I'm getting married on the 18th May'

Grandad (to Donald) "And I suppose you're getting married on the 25th?"

Donald "No, the 26th actually"

G. to M. "And where are you getting married?"

M. "Torquay"

G. "OK I'll come to that. David?"

Da. "Hamilton Terrace" (St Johns Wood)

G. "Thats alright. Donald?"

Do. "Morpeth" (Northumberland)

G."Too far. David will represent me" (and he did!)

Doug Dean · Aircraftsman 1st Class

Sorry managed to post above twice but can't delete whole posting!

-- Edited by Doug Dean on Tuesday 12th of July 2011 03:08:27 PM

-- Edited by Doug Dean on Tuesday 12th of July 2011 03:09:34 PM

michaeldean · Aircraftsman 1st Class

hi Juliet

thanks for your post. yes I would be interested in any info that you have.

My father spoke about Alan Ball a great deal. They were obviously best of friends. I have various memories from what he has told me but he really did not speak much himself about his activities and I not sure who did what!

feel free to use my email. is is my login to this form plus 99 and it is a gmail.com account

michael

shenglu · Aircraftsman 1st Class

I know not much about the exploits of 61 Squadron, at night (just know that the order from the Group of 61 and 106 SQD. Sent 11 Lancasters together, I hope you can give me some details of 61 SQD send Lancs.

AW · Air Commodore

-- Edited by AW on Friday 28th of October 2011 09:29:17 AM

Date: Jun 5, 2012

Hello Niall! If your grandfather was D.F.E.C.Dean I can probably help. My Donald Dean died some 10 or more years ago and had a very big obituary in the Times or Telegraph. He did ditch in the sea on a couple of occasions and post war did spend time working n Insurance in the Middle East. He lost out during a mideast coup and returned to UK. I believe you said that your Donald Dean was still alive in 2010 so we may have a different person but the stories are remarkably similar. I don't think DFEC Dean was in 617 Sqdn and he was one of the RAF's youngest Group Captains.

Date: Aug 23, 2012

Hi, Busy Lizzie here.

If anyone is interested we launched "Friends of the Pathfinders" this last week on the 70th Anniversary.

Next Monday 27th August we have an open Day at Offord Cluny (North of St Neots) just off the A1...

I have created a roadshow of memorabilia of my Dad's and am taking it round to raise funds for the RAF Benevolent fund and All Saint's Church, Offord Cluny.

This church has a stained glass window with a Lancaster and an RAF corner with the standard from 35 Squadron (Graveley).

Open day will start at 10.30am but people are welcome anytime to wander around the church and memorial at the airfield site. The day will finish in the evening with a concertin the church of Vera Lyn type songs.

Hope to see you there!

Julie

Date: Apr 7, 2013

My father served in Bomber Command during the war and was with Group Captain Donald "Dixie" Dean in the final weeks of the war when Dixie was acting CO of RAF Blyton which was an aircrew holding unit and my father was his adjutant. They were both waiting to be released from the Service. My father has written a book about his time in the RAF (unpublished) but the last chapter contains quite a lot about Dixie and his pre-demob escapades with my father. They kept in touch for a short while and I can remember Dixie coming to our home in Harrow for a couple of visits. I was eight years old at the time. My father died in 1989.

If you wish to receive a copy of this last chapter I can forward it to you.

brian.lee45@ntlworld.com

Date: Apr 9, 2013

Hi Brian
Thanks for contacting the message board.

I would be very interested in receiving any information regarding my father (Donald Fredric Edgar Charles Dean) or for short 'Dixie'. We have accumulated a reasonable amount of information on his activities during the war but he never discussed it with us children. I know that he had a lot of trouble after the war with the heavy bombing he had to do. He did 98 bombing flights (as mentioned on this board) over Germany and 9 (I thought it was) as pathfinders, just sitting over the targets knowing that the odds of surviving were stacked against you!

Thanks again
michaeldean99@gmail.com

Date: May 19, 2014

Hello Brian
I would appreciate a copy of the last chapter being being emailed to me.

The last year has been difficult for me and I am not sure whether you have already emailed it and I have lost it!

Thanks again
michaeldean99@gmail.com